It might be time to drop cable.

Comparing streaming prices

After seeing my Spectrum bill had gone up another $30/mth despite losing 2 movie channel networks I called them to see if a better bundle might be had. Not only was there no better deal but it seems now that the bundle only gets you $10 off the total so the old "internet only cost you almost as much as the bundle" days seem to be over. I also discovered the local channels are $17.99 of that Gold bundle price on top of the $123.99 for the cable channels which include HBO, Showtime and Starz. You add in the required cablecard fee (even if you are not using it) of $2 the effective cost is $133.98. Note this is without any DVR ability so technically you might need to add a tuner fee if you have a DVR or another $23/mth for their DVR. Since the services all seem to have some a cloud DVR component a better compare cost would be more but it really does not matter since all the services I looked at were cheaper. Even after recent price increases. With the possible exception of AT&T. (See below.)

Here is the sheet I used to compare the services. 

Note not all movie channels are available on all services but they all are from Amazon for the same price as other places so I put in that cost where not available to include in the equiv total cost.

Note AT&T is a weird case that would be hard to compare if not already higher than the others. In the sheet it shows the compare prices with the "ENTERTAINMENT" + the listed later costs for channels. From their site it appears this is not actually an option. See note on PREMIER package equiv cost.

Lastly note there are "fees" on top of these prices that will make the comparisons a bit off.

DVRs

I should note here beyond the initial hardware costs most DVRs require a subscription cost. TiVo for example is $75.76/year and Tablo is $49.99 USD/year for the guide plus $20.00 USD/year if you want to auto skip ads. Note Tablo ad skip is iffy at best and TiVo's is getting worse. Another reason for going YouTube TV is that it includes the local PBS which means I should be able to shutdown my TiVo and Tablo and use the YouTube cloud DVR instead. There are 32 Over The Air (OTA) channels watchable here but realistically only 6 of the 7 YouTube TV can record, I really care about. ~1/4 of the 32 are in Spanish and most are showing old programs or infomercials. The George Burns and Gracie Allen Show for instance, is available from several places. Even the somewhat obscure Rat Patrol is on Pluto TV. Though you might like something like The Unseen World which is only available on OTA channels.

One of the things I've lost with an OTA DVR instead of a cable DVR is being able to watch a cable show shortly after it starts. Most of the streaming services, even when offering live, only offer on demand sometime later. In some cases they can run up to an episode behind meaning a week or more after the broadcast. I'm hoping the cloud DVRs will give me that back and will not be anymore flaky than TiVo has become much less Tablos are.

Conclusion

It looks like YouTube TV is the best fit for me but I watch stuff on a lot of channels. For example, BBC News is one of those news programs I like to watch timeshifted in the morning. BBC World News and BBC America both seem to to be option or not available most places. With an OTA DVR I can still get a wee hours broadcast from PBS but it would be nice to catch one closer to the current time. 

Update 9/15/2021

Pretty happy with Youtube so far. Went into Spectrum store to turn in my cable card (I had to have per my bundle despite not using) and turn off my cable. They took the card but could not change the cable. So I called in and they are like well if you are going to turn off the service we can give you a discount. So I'm trying their cloud DVR service which I had not even heard of. Still not sure how I missed that when looking for options. The first year price is about $50 less than what I was paying for all the same channels. Of course knowing their hardware DVR there are questions about if it will actually be usable. Also the person on the phone had no record of me turning in the cable card so I'll have to see if they try and charge me for that. Awhile later installer called thinking I was new service. He was trying to find my place. Explained that I have the latest hardware do no need. You got to wonder.

After I've tried it side by side with Youtube's cloud DVR. 

Also they were trying to talk me into their cell service. Only $14 vs the $55 for 2 lines I'm paying now so I'm going to have to think about switching after my V60 is paid off in 11 months.

Tablo Amazon review

My review as it is on Amazon with links added.

I've been looking for a TiVo replacement since TiVo seems intent on driving away all their DVR customers. The Fire TV Recast having only 720p max output was a non starter for me and Tablo seemed to be the favorite so started with it. Coming from TiVo the Tablo interface is a bit of a let down. But on the plus side it is viewable from a Roku or browser. The main issue for me is the lack of being able to visually fast forward till a bit after something has finished recording. Commercial skip works a bit less often and well than TiVo but happens shortly after the recording is done instead like TiVo where it can be a day before it kicks in. Still not sure if commercial skip is worth the added subscription cost. The most disturbing is I've had a few bouts of unexplained "reboots" with the Tablo.  In quotes because it is impossible to know for sure given the lack of accessible logs or debug info screens plus having to access via another device. When they happen all recordings stop for a bit though so it is as disruptive as a reboot. Looking at TiVo recordings running in parallel it does not appear to be a signal issue like others have reported. I should note the one time I was able to see a signal issue in action the TiVo recovered while the Tablo just stopped recording. Support was unable to sort what was causing the "reboots" either. It was annoying enough I got a HDHomeRun Quad scribe to compare but have not had a "reboot" issue in the week all 3 have been running. The HDHomeRun interface is no where near as polished as even the Tablo and its apps appear to mainly useless. So Tablo for all its faults appears to the better TiVo replacement. Though I'm going to look into Plex using the HDHomeRun tuners as well. 

Updates:

Let me add adding apps to my Fire TV with 4K Ultra HD has proven almost impossible so giving the Fire TV Recast a pass seems to have been a good call as I'd probably need a newer Fire TV to even get it to work.

1/6/2021

Tablo worked fine for about a week then did the reboot thing for 6 days worked for one and is failing again today 

More detailed reviews in works but wanting to find a acceptable solution first. Looking like as bad as TiVo has become it might still be better than the alternatives. Still have building a Plex PC using the HDHomeRun as the tuners on the todo list though.

2/9/2021

More random reboot waves (confirmed by monitoring it drop off the network with continuous pings) even after adding a laptop cooler below to the 80mm fan on top of the Tablo. Decided to swap out the Western Digital 2TB WD Blue Mobile Hard Drive with a Samsung SSD 860 EVO 1TB I had bought for another project while I run tests on the 2TB drive and see if that gives me any clues. Note it took 3 tries to get the SSD to format and after it still seems to think I have recordings so I'm no hopeful.

I found this which suggests a external is the way to go which I might try since the issue is at least made worse by heat.

WeaKnees Single 3 TB Replace TiVo Upgrade Kit for 849000 install

Single 3 TB Replace TiVo Upgrade Kit for 849000

If you follow the instructions the hardware part goes pretty smoothly. Step 1D is the only tricky part. Read the whole bit about how to apply pressure in steps or you might break off a tab.

BUT before you start get kmttg before you start the upgrade and save off your settings:

• One Passes
• Thumbs (Though it seems TiVo might not be using these anymore.)
• Channels

Otherwise you will be manually be setting them up again. Note in theory One Passes should be downloaded from your TiVo account but if you want to have them today you will need to load them via kmttg.

Next bit is you will probably need to call your cable company and have them push an activate to your cable card even though the host ID does not change.

If you favorited channels you will need do those again manually.

Lastly you will need to reactivate all your apps.

Update: looks like you need to turn auto skip back on as well.

After the upgrade you should find:
recordingCapacityHdHours       476
recordingCapacitySdHours       3274
freeDiskSpaceSdHours           3212
freeDiskSpaceHdHours           465

Note part of that used space was programs already recorded by my uploaded One Passes.

If 3 TB is a bit tight you should know WeeKnees has options with Bolts up to 13TB and Roamios up the 20 TB

Updated Cord Cutting Notes sheet to pull TiVo data

My watched vs available sheet Cord Cutting Notes  now pulls in the csv files created by my TiVoGet program as part of the Last Show update. I also updated the menu to the new sheet model. (Something you seem to need to do now if you edit a sheet script with the old menu model in it.)

Created a TiVo info downloader

The Git project is at https://github.com/avatar42/TiVoGet

The idea is you have this run each night (Task Scheduler or cron) to update csv files in your Google Drive and the use the SheetGo Plugin to read in the info from the csv files to your copy of my Cord Cutting Notes sheet Then I should be able add automation to look at shows watched (watchedTime > 0) in the Now Playing list to auto update the sheet. In theory I could use this to get latest available episode info as well for any shows not listed in ShowRSS.

Signal issues and deafening commercials giving me second thoughts

Last night's adventure 

Was getting ready for bed last night an went to turn on Colbert on the Tivo and found dead air. Flipped to ABC and it was dead too. This was to be my third debug mission just since I started for bed some 2 hours ago at this point so I was not happy! Having cable flashbacks I tried all the usual quick fixes including pulling stuff from the Goodwill pile to swap out but no help. Using my TiVo into signal strength mode and found the signal strengths were the same with either amp. Plus they were about what I recorded over a month ago. So finally I gave up and went to bed thinking the antenna must have slipped or something and it would just need to wait. However ABC and CBS look fine today so thinking they must be testing dropping to a lower power at night or something. I noticed ABC seemed weak the other early morning too. I messaged both to confirm. But no reply as yet. Does not bode well. Especially combined with the CW having slipped below the watchable at least 50% of the time level.

So now what?

You might recall I started streaming stuff I can't get over the air since last November when I got fed up with Time Warner knocking my cable box (tuner) and sometimes even my TiVo off line. I've been mainly streaming from Hulu or the network's sites since TWC's streaming is usually days behind everywhere else. I can not stream the morning news though. And I have to admit I'm getting pretty fed up with the cranked up commercials most of the networks are streaming. I have to sit with one hand on the mute button they are so much worse than when the feds stepped in back in 2011 to make them stop it when broadcasting. So I'm thinking of just switching my remaining TiVo back to cable for any broadcasts not on Hulu. Especially since now that Comedy Central is pulling their stuff off Hulu and using those windows rattling commercials on their streaming site. Plus it would be nice to see The Daily Show and @midnight on the same day they broadcast again. In a related story I found my missing extra cable card last weekend. No less than 3 times Time Warner has told me they have taken it off my bill since it was never activated because they sent it without a tuner about 2 years ago. Just checked and they are still monthly charging me for it. Granted not enough to warrant a special 50 mile round trip to town just to turn it in. So it all this seems to be telling me I should give a more hybrid approach (cable card but no tuner) a try to see if TWC can keep from knocking it off line. And even if they do it is starting to look like I probably will not be worse off. It is either that or try and cobble together an even stronger antenna / amp combo which would seem to probably require a radio tower to get more signal over the ridge. That does not seem like that good of an investment if the stations might be turning down the power.

Moving info here

Thinking there is getting to be enough info that it needs to be structured and searchable so I'll start moving posts here. Below it the original doc that accompanied the show tracking spreadsheet.

I'll keep adding to this page but to start I've been building a spreadsheet to replace the watch list features of my TiVos that some of you might be interested in making a copy of. Below kind of explains why and what I was trying to achieve.

Some history

Basically I've had TiVos since they first came out and loved them. I still have 2 Premieres and a series 2 setting on the shelf with old shows on them plus my 2 connected up Roamios.  But around 2 years ago now Time Warner started jacking with the cable boxes to knock them off line randomly around once a month. I setup a second TiVo so it could act as a backup in case one got knocked offline but found they almost always got knocked out within an hour or two of each other. Often I’d have to call Time Warner to reauth one or both boxes after it happened. Pretty obvious some sort of received signal was the cause but Time Warner was still claiming it was not them so I switched the TiVo that could still receive broadcast TV to do that instead. (Note most TiVos now only work with cable and will not receive Over The Air aka OTA broadcasts. As of the Roamio series, TiVos only receive cable or OTA not both at the same time like previous models did.) Next Rovi bought TiVo and decided to swap out TiVo's accurate and detailed guide (the MAIN selling point of TiVo) with their own. That change / glitch caused about 2 weeks loss of recordings for most of their customers and ever since my cable connected TiVo would just stop receiving signals randomly requiring a reboot to fix. So I started looking at what would be involved in just going with streaming and OTA. To keep it all straight in my head and to help come up with a plan I started the sheet above.

Summary of things learned

For the most part going without a DVR seems doable if you still pay for cable as most of the network streaming sites still only work if you have a cable subscription.

With Time Warner it appears it can actually cost you more to get just internet than internet + cable + phone. Plus a Time Warner DVR used to be in the bundle or $5 to $10 per month. Now is $25 per month. That is more a month than getting a TiVo on contract plus the monthly cable card fee!

Keeping track of what you already watched and if something new is available is almost impossible even with a TiVo when streaming is in the mix unless you have something like the above sheet.

If you want to watch something within a day or two of broadcast but not live you still need a DVR. (For instance if you watch the news or a late night talk show on your schedule you will want at least an OTA DVR.)

You will probably need to get used to commercials again. Almost everything streaming outside of Hulu and Netflix has commercials you can not skip. CBS is the exception with a commercial free option for $9.99/month but you mainly only get the last 7 episodes of current shows so it is pretty pricey for what you get.

A TiVo OTA might still be cost effective compared to other OTA DVRs but the last TiVo update has REALLY slowed it down so jury is still out.

Most networks still don't get it. A LOT of shows you will only find the last 3 to 7 episodes available for streaming even with commercials. Outside of Netflix of course. But even on Netflix more and more shows are DVD only.

Why do you need a spreadsheet?

The TiVo OnePass system would not only automatically deal with recording at changing show times but would also show you what shows were available to watch, both recorded locally and streaming. The streaming bit has some issues but it still helps. If you watch more than a few shows you quickly see how much of a time saver this is, when it works. But the Tivo only tracks stuff it can stream or record so your OTA Tivo will not know anything about what is on AMC, for example, while a Roku would even though the Roku AMC app does not work with a Time Warner ID to watch their shows right now.  So in order to have something that works I came up with this some what manual option.

So first thing you will want is a list of what is new this week. The sheet grabs an RSS feed for that.

Next you will want to compare the last available episode (shows:C) from that feed against the last you watched (shows:B) to know if there is something new to see. Colors change to let you know if you are ahead (watched live) or behind what the feed sees as the last episode.

Lastly you will want to know where the best place is to go see it and a backup if that fails.There is a place for you fav (shows:E) and all the other places you can get it (shows:J-X).

Plus if you watch the same shows I do I've done a lot of the work for you. The sheet is by no means done but there is already a ton of info on the 91 shows I'm currently tracking. I'll be adding stuff as I go.

There are also links to some helpful info and compares of devices and streaming sources.